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A question concerning Chinese white violins.
I use these for varnish experiments and sell them cheaply to a school teacher. The archings all look identical and after varnishing one can often see faint router marks. I would like to know how many think that they have accurately copied some particular Strad. They certainly are not hand-carved. But how uniform are samples from the same company?
Do they differ from a good Strad arch ? Any comments? I can't see the best copiests in all fields not using an actual Strad for measuring all the details of arching. But I dont' know. Maybe the entire membership has seen enough real Strads to make comments. I would really like a vote on this question, so don't neglect to respond.
Thanks, John
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Johnmasters
Member Since 15 Aug 2005Offline Last Active Yesterday, 02:39 PM
About Me
Interest in many sciences. Motorcycles, music, all the rest. Started piano at 4, switched to violin at 7. Main instrument viola for about 30 years. Enjoy orchestra.
Started making as a hobby at 16, 1960. Started full-time shop in 1972. Self-taught but had a pretty good teacher. Not too much interested in old instruments except as aesthetic objects. I think that the science lies elsewhere.
MS degree in physics, graduate school left for greener pastures, 1988
Strong interest in varnishes, presently in emulsion application form. This is very versatile and I invite questions. jmluthier@sbcglobal.net
Sometime a pain in the arse. Like to argue science points. Have background in physics and trying to refine my understanding acoustics from a math and physics point of view.
Started making as a hobby at 16, 1960. Started full-time shop in 1972. Self-taught but had a pretty good teacher. Not too much interested in old instruments except as aesthetic objects. I think that the science lies elsewhere.
MS degree in physics, graduate school left for greener pastures, 1988
Strong interest in varnishes, presently in emulsion application form. This is very versatile and I invite questions. jmluthier@sbcglobal.net
Sometime a pain in the arse. Like to argue science points. Have background in physics and trying to refine my understanding acoustics from a math and physics point of view.
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Chinese machine-made violins.
28 April 2013 - 01:08 PM
A Tutorial
14 April 2013 - 02:48 PM
Faint memory of historical lawsuit
27 September 2012 - 12:00 PM
I recall reading a long time ago about an ancient lawsuit. Apparently, someone found the account in some archival material. The date was back in the 1700's as I recall.
Someone was sued because he sold a violin (by a now-famous maker) as an "old" violin, perhaps an Amati. The violin was actually made by someone alive at the time.
The court pointed out that "it is well known that older violins have higher value than new ones."
If this actually happened, it would be very interesting on at least three points...
A:) If it was collector value, that would show that violins even then were considered art works.
B:) If it was only a question of sound qualities, that would also be interesting.
C:) It could show that some new violins were antiqued early on.
Does anyone recall hearing of this account? Bruce Carlson, you might know about this. My memory is not at all perfect ..........
Someone was sued because he sold a violin (by a now-famous maker) as an "old" violin, perhaps an Amati. The violin was actually made by someone alive at the time.
The court pointed out that "it is well known that older violins have higher value than new ones."
If this actually happened, it would be very interesting on at least three points...
A:) If it was collector value, that would show that violins even then were considered art works.
B:) If it was only a question of sound qualities, that would also be interesting.
C:) It could show that some new violins were antiqued early on.
Does anyone recall hearing of this account? Bruce Carlson, you might know about this. My memory is not at all perfect ..........
Shaping fingerboards
15 August 2012 - 08:37 PM
As I have mentioned eleswhere, I do experiments of various kinds on Chinese white violins. These usually have a fingerboard of about the right thickness but are flat on the underside. There is not enough wood to plane an upward plane on the flat side, from heel end to the bridge.
I take these off, heat them thoroughly and bend them just as one would a bow. There are a lot of resins in the wood, so that they stay shaped just as would a bow bent with heat.
Then shallow chords can be cut off or flattened (I use a belt sander). One need only insure that the join of the planes is very near the edge of the heel. It works well. It also increases the curvature somewhat. If this is already too much, it is not hard to rectify.
Has anyone else done this and care to share your experince?
I take these off, heat them thoroughly and bend them just as one would a bow. There are a lot of resins in the wood, so that they stay shaped just as would a bow bent with heat.
Then shallow chords can be cut off or flattened (I use a belt sander). One need only insure that the join of the planes is very near the edge of the heel. It works well. It also increases the curvature somewhat. If this is already too much, it is not hard to rectify.
Has anyone else done this and care to share your experince?
What is "Handmade" ?
15 August 2012 - 03:37 PM
http://www.maestrone...c=323802&st=179
This is an old topic for argument, but I have had a challenge about "machine made" violins involving CNC and using a laser scanner to copy an existing violin.
People usually copy famous-name instruments by hand cutting and measuring. Is this more hand made than to find the coordinants of an arching and cutting them with a machine ?
Keep in mind that this is a roughing technique. The finish surface would be by the maker in this case or the totally hand-made case. I argue that most makers use machines up to certain point. The idea is that the machine does what the maker wants. So at what level does one abandon machine usage?
The finish surface will be all hand work in any case, and will reflect the skill of a maker. There are romantics out there who don't like any machines, and cut out plates with a coping saw. Others may use pantograph cutters, although I have never heard anyone admit this.
Where does romance stop and useful machine work continue?
Comments welcome. I think there is a misconception about "machine made" and even one about "hand made."
This is an old topic for argument, but I have had a challenge about "machine made" violins involving CNC and using a laser scanner to copy an existing violin.
People usually copy famous-name instruments by hand cutting and measuring. Is this more hand made than to find the coordinants of an arching and cutting them with a machine ?
Keep in mind that this is a roughing technique. The finish surface would be by the maker in this case or the totally hand-made case. I argue that most makers use machines up to certain point. The idea is that the machine does what the maker wants. So at what level does one abandon machine usage?
The finish surface will be all hand work in any case, and will reflect the skill of a maker. There are romantics out there who don't like any machines, and cut out plates with a coping saw. Others may use pantograph cutters, although I have never heard anyone admit this.
Where does romance stop and useful machine work continue?
Comments welcome. I think there is a misconception about "machine made" and even one about "hand made."
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