5 replies to this topic

[Arash]

Hello all,

I am asking this question on behalf of a friend who makes Middle Eastern lutes. Traditionally they use a type of glue, which, I think, is best described as animal based hot glue. But I am unsure as to what type of hide or bone they might use in the glue. He has asked me to see what other alternatives may exist. The glue has to be very strong and water soluble in case of repairs. It is usually used to glue the two sides of the wooden "bowl" of the lute, but also to glue camel bone to the neck which makes the fingerboard. In some cases, the peg box is also constructed out of little pieces of wood which are then glued together. My friend is particularly interested in fish based hot glue.

I am myself in the UK and would be grateful for any advice you might be able to provide. Since his main interest is fish based hot glue, I wonder what people here think about this glue and where I might be able to purchase it. I would love to hear about alternatives so that I can put together a sample of glues for him to experiment with.

Many thanks in advance.

[DGerald StephenR]

Hello Gargan,

I would recommend sticking (get-it? zing-pow ) with hide-glue for your friend, certain with it being the traditional glue used in the construction of ouds and other Middle Eastern lute type instruments. Hide glue is available in different strengths and I imagine several members of this board who are located in the UK can steer you into the direction of a reputable store to purchase from.
Fish glue I personally haven't come across in a "hot" format. Fish glue is very high tack and here in Canada we can purchase it from a shop like Lee Valley Tools and I'm sure a similar UK shop would have an equivalent product that one of the members here could suggest for you.

Best of luck to your friend

[garyr]

Here's a how to from China:

http://lakemontstrin...a=page=1&page=1

I can't vouch for the info, but it looked interesting enough that I thought I'd get some fish swim bladders next time I'm near a chinese apothecary and see how it works.

[Jeffrey Holmes]

I can't vouch for the info, but it looked interesting enough that I thought I'd get some fish swim bladders next time I'm near a chinese apothecary and see how it works.

Yuk. I think I'll stick to my nice clean dry bagged hide glue.

Garyr; How come you seem so set on linking that site?

[garyr]

I just saw it last week. I think the work process of all these Chinese violin makers is interesting and it's the first thing I've seen that lays what they do and seems different from US and European makers. I've gotten a couple of fiddles via Yita over the last year or two and am curious how they turn out half decent instruments so cheaply. Part of it seems to be that they make things themselves that other just go out and buy - even down to things like glue. Part of it is that they have no shortage of semi trained labor, farmers that have always done carpentry in the winter for subsistence.

I'm no violin maker, I think refretting a guitar is the most complicated thing I've ever done to an instrument. I did build a cornemuse from an EMS kit one too - so I'm also curious what talented westerm makers think of the more old fasioned and probably eccentric techniques they are using.

[Arash]

Hello Gargan,

I would recommend sticking (get-it? zing-pow ) with hide-glue for your friend, certain with it being the traditional glue used in the construction of ouds and other Middle Eastern lute type instruments. Hide glue is available in different strengths and I imagine several members of this board who are located in the UK can steer you into the direction of a reputable store to purchase from.
Fish glue I personally haven't come across in a "hot" format. Fish glue is very high tack and here in Canada we can purchase it from a shop like Lee Valley Tools and I'm sure a similar UK shop would have an equivalent product that one of the members here could suggest for you.

Best of luck to your friend

Hi Gerald and others,

I agree with you that the traditional glue might be best, but as is often the case, the traditional method can die out quite quickly once foreign products enter the market. I know of several lute makers who have comletely changed to using Titebond, trusting that a Western product will be better!!! In this particular case, I am glad that my friend is willing to explore and research the options.

So, if I understand it correctly, fish glue is very strong but not necessarily used in Violin making. Is that right? Would it be correct to say, that hide glue is the traditional glue in Violin making?